I’m interested, how do you reconcile the idea of Rachel as an identitarian cypher if Melissa Broder is also Jewish, queer, anorexic? (I toe the line at describing Rachel as abused by her mother overall, just because I think we actually are supposed to feel some kind of perverted pleasure in the fact the way Rachel sees herself, as she does, and I think the novel portrays Rachel's relationship with her mother as something more than abusive, as many complex family dynamics are. This is not an endorsement of Rachel's awful mother!) Sometimes I feel like a lot of these kinds of critiques are enacting a kind of Red Scare mindset — coming from such a place of bad faith as to think that nobody could possibly have genuine affinity for or solidarity with an identity bloc. I am sick of identity politics the same as anyone, but I also feel that many class reductionist arguments of culture — or even just arguments that attempt to chalk representation up to "box-ticking" — lately ignore the fact that people just have deep connections to their identity, especially ethnic and racial.
Sorry, this is veering into annoying comment territory: I got the sense that Broder understood intimately — as in, had NO distance from — the eating disorder bits, but also I’m extremely interested in your characterisation of Rachel as a pro-Palestinian mouthpiece. Did you not feel tension in her own opinions there? I felt it as a kind of nature vs nurture clash — Rachel finally feels at home with Her People, but the distinct harshness and Americanism of her mother’s parenting forces her to articulate what she sees as an incontrovertible moral good. That in comparison to Miriam, who is so beholden to family and community that she refuses to even come out. Like, neither being right but both being products of their environment that literally can never reconcile. Anyway, thrilled you read Milk Fed and can't wait to hear your response.
sorry, truly an awful and annoying comment, but genuinely wanted to hear your response, tried to send it on instagram lol but the message was t oo long
No, definitely not awful or annoying! I appreciate you taking the time to properly respond, it’s both very sweet and necessary, because you pull me up on a point I was lazy on describing. Definitely veered into RS talk as a shorthand there, but that’s not exactly what I meant.
I know Broder is writing from personal experience, but I guess that’s maybe the downside of the ‘thinness’ I mention: when a book doesn’t connect with you, the bigger ideas/explorations of identity (which yes, are totally genuine and profound, and I do think that comes through most with her relation to Miriam’s Jewishness) can feel a little flat.
I also like your reading of the relo with the mother, I totally agree (again, lazy shorthand)! I found the scenes where her mum tried to break through her radio silence some of the most affecting. Reminded me a lot of the mother in Enlightened.
I like that reading of her tension in wanting comfort in Miriam’s family and her own upbringing, it’s much more forgiving than mine. That’s definitely what the book aims for, but I guess for me - and maybe because I mostly know Broder through sosadtoday - it felt like the book assumed you would be an equally online person who would side with her on what is an incredibly divisive issue even among “liberal” people (and it shouldn’t be at all, to be clear, very obvious human rights abuses against Palestinian people!). I guess on one level I appreciate that, but to me it just felt a bit unearned/not really explored in any tangible way - to me, Rachel’s objections throughout about the IDF felt against her character, who generally didn’t seem to care about much about... anything?
I think that changes in the novel as her world expands, but this and a few other references to ‘social causes’ felt a little... incongruent? But typing this out, I think maybe that’s on me to expect that character to not have political opinions/I went in with a certain mould of what this now archetypical affectless narrator offers.
I know you and Katie both really liked it, and I respect your opinions a lot, so I have a feeling I might’ve just been a little ungenerous, or enjoyed the beginning and got a bit bored by the relationship with Miriam, due to my own interests atm?
Anyway I’m keen to read The Pisces and see where I land, as I really enjoyed some bits - though I found a lot of the descriptive writing incredibly irritating and hammy?
Idk if that answers your questions really! But thank you for asking them all the same and if you can CBF, feel free to respond!
Hi Jared, love this, can’t wait to read more.
I’m interested, how do you reconcile the idea of Rachel as an identitarian cypher if Melissa Broder is also Jewish, queer, anorexic? (I toe the line at describing Rachel as abused by her mother overall, just because I think we actually are supposed to feel some kind of perverted pleasure in the fact the way Rachel sees herself, as she does, and I think the novel portrays Rachel's relationship with her mother as something more than abusive, as many complex family dynamics are. This is not an endorsement of Rachel's awful mother!) Sometimes I feel like a lot of these kinds of critiques are enacting a kind of Red Scare mindset — coming from such a place of bad faith as to think that nobody could possibly have genuine affinity for or solidarity with an identity bloc. I am sick of identity politics the same as anyone, but I also feel that many class reductionist arguments of culture — or even just arguments that attempt to chalk representation up to "box-ticking" — lately ignore the fact that people just have deep connections to their identity, especially ethnic and racial.
Sorry, this is veering into annoying comment territory: I got the sense that Broder understood intimately — as in, had NO distance from — the eating disorder bits, but also I’m extremely interested in your characterisation of Rachel as a pro-Palestinian mouthpiece. Did you not feel tension in her own opinions there? I felt it as a kind of nature vs nurture clash — Rachel finally feels at home with Her People, but the distinct harshness and Americanism of her mother’s parenting forces her to articulate what she sees as an incontrovertible moral good. That in comparison to Miriam, who is so beholden to family and community that she refuses to even come out. Like, neither being right but both being products of their environment that literally can never reconcile. Anyway, thrilled you read Milk Fed and can't wait to hear your response.
sorry, truly an awful and annoying comment, but genuinely wanted to hear your response, tried to send it on instagram lol but the message was t oo long
No, definitely not awful or annoying! I appreciate you taking the time to properly respond, it’s both very sweet and necessary, because you pull me up on a point I was lazy on describing. Definitely veered into RS talk as a shorthand there, but that’s not exactly what I meant.
I know Broder is writing from personal experience, but I guess that’s maybe the downside of the ‘thinness’ I mention: when a book doesn’t connect with you, the bigger ideas/explorations of identity (which yes, are totally genuine and profound, and I do think that comes through most with her relation to Miriam’s Jewishness) can feel a little flat.
I also like your reading of the relo with the mother, I totally agree (again, lazy shorthand)! I found the scenes where her mum tried to break through her radio silence some of the most affecting. Reminded me a lot of the mother in Enlightened.
I like that reading of her tension in wanting comfort in Miriam’s family and her own upbringing, it’s much more forgiving than mine. That’s definitely what the book aims for, but I guess for me - and maybe because I mostly know Broder through sosadtoday - it felt like the book assumed you would be an equally online person who would side with her on what is an incredibly divisive issue even among “liberal” people (and it shouldn’t be at all, to be clear, very obvious human rights abuses against Palestinian people!). I guess on one level I appreciate that, but to me it just felt a bit unearned/not really explored in any tangible way - to me, Rachel’s objections throughout about the IDF felt against her character, who generally didn’t seem to care about much about... anything?
I think that changes in the novel as her world expands, but this and a few other references to ‘social causes’ felt a little... incongruent? But typing this out, I think maybe that’s on me to expect that character to not have political opinions/I went in with a certain mould of what this now archetypical affectless narrator offers.
I know you and Katie both really liked it, and I respect your opinions a lot, so I have a feeling I might’ve just been a little ungenerous, or enjoyed the beginning and got a bit bored by the relationship with Miriam, due to my own interests atm?
Anyway I’m keen to read The Pisces and see where I land, as I really enjoyed some bits - though I found a lot of the descriptive writing incredibly irritating and hammy?
Idk if that answers your questions really! But thank you for asking them all the same and if you can CBF, feel free to respond!